Twelve Tribes Communities. A warning [from a fellow traveler]
Source: Reddit.com
From Vagabond, posted on 25 of January 2016
So mainly in the northeast but also in Tennessee, Georgia, and even Europe there’s this group they call themselves the 12 tribes. They are really really (like freakishly) nice to travelers, and recruit them for the communities. Basically they invited you back to the compound, and make it increasingly harder and harder to leave. Nobody is ever forcing you, but the promise of food for the day, weed to smoke (even tho i came to find out that its just something to keep people around, none of the people in the church actually smoke pot) and a little bit of cash is enough sometimes to deal with the weirdness. But then things get weirder. I’ve had friends told me that they were offered peoples daughters as wives. In most places where they have a community they also have a deli/coffee shop/something like that. At these restaurants the wives do all of the cooking, cleaning, and general work while the husbands are talking to customers and recruiting. They have zines that are directed at punk youth, which bad brains, the misfits and black flag logos on the front but you open it up and its all about their fucking weird religion. I just wanted to put a warning out there for people who don’t know who they are (i sure as shit didn’t until we got to Vermont and these dudes were everywhere!) Eat the food they give you, go to the deli’s and hang out or whatever, but do your research too, these guys are fucking wacky.
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I was in the Tribes for a few years, and I most say I found it to be one of the saddest experiences of my life, why….Because they look, act fell and teach many things that are true, but Christ said, you will know them by their fruit, a good tree cannot produce bad fruit. Because while there, I had marriage problems, which at first they tried to correct but later separated us against my will, against scripture that says a women shall not have authority over her husband, and the wife is to be submissive, Goggle it, and after giving up all as Luke 14:33 in order to follow Christ, they later would not forgive me for things when I tried to repent even though Luke 17:4 Says “If your brother sins against you seven times a day and comes back to say I Repent, then you shall forgive them” when I brought this issue up and they told me, “We can’t just forgive someone if they say I repent, because if we did people would keep sinning.” At that point I was shocked since I realized they were disagreeing with Christ not me. Then after I was sent away from my wife and kids after trying to repent, I did more research in line ( Goggle, child molesting in the twelve tribes) case after case after case of Ex members who were there as children were molested, one even by the Apostles wife who tried to cover it up for several years, I’ve been incredibly sad since learning these things since on the outside they look so real, loving, and kind, is this what Christ meant when He said, “Take heed, for many will come in my name and deceive many.” I went to the Tribes originally because I could not find the life of Love in Christainity, it seemed to me Christainity wanted to serve Money and God at the same time, but these people lived not that way for the most part. I swear all my statements I have made are truthful, Best Wishes in your search, for the whole world is coming under the control of the Evil One. Respectfully Martin.
HI Andrew, How long did you stay in Vista? I have visited there many times over the last 7 years when my friend Armen moved there.
Well…where to start. RUN far away is my advise as a person who joined full on there close to ten years. They strip you of your identity entirely, make you a slave, disconnect you from your biological family, and herd you into full compliance. Children are slaves, uneducated in basic educational skills and if one child in a group mid-behaves they ALL get harshly thrashed with sticks enough to create welts. Single adults are worked hard without pay usually 7 days a week 15 hour days including Sabbaths because then they get to babysit the married people’s children so the couple can have sex. False teachings and men leaders who take all the money and lavish themselves with meals out while the slaves under them eat millet , moldy food, and bread. Desperate for nutrients I started to beg for pig worthy food from supermarkets to feed households of fifty people by carving out the bad parts. I could write volumes on the sins of the elders who preach love, but don’t practice it. One child was beaten with a 2 by 4 until their tailbone was broken. Another priceless woman was in a bad car accident and her head was taken off in that accident-later they said she deserved it. I knew her well and she NEVER deserved it! Shallow graves with children buried in them. It all looks really good on the surface but underneath the truth is the abuse is horrid. Again, RUN as far and as fast away from them as your feet can carry you!
so true MOM,
you tell it like it is,
is their not obligation to help those in need , what ever ones creed or belief is ?
those people need help
Was that the wife of Levi, who was in the bad accident? I lived with them for a while in St Joe, this happened to a lady there.
Run away as fast as you can. I have help a few escape from their communities. The beating of the children is true, they have gotten very good at not leaving marks or evidence. Children drive forklifts, heavy equipment, power tools, etc. Once you join you are required to surrender all your worldly goods to them including money, pensions, bank accounts. Stay away from them at all costs.
@Wicked Witch:
I always hear “don’t go there” from ex-members and alike. But I ask You: where to live a godly life with one’s children then? What do YOU have to offer as an alternative concerning living up to bible standards?
Be a positive example and name alternatives please if you have em. Don’t let us prospects stand in the rain
Because living in a world devoid of godly upbringing of children cannot be the answer, now can it?
I am not an advocate of communal living very much, but having lived at various times at each, i would recommend the Bruderhof communities far over the Twelve Tribes. I think the TT started out with good intentions, but for people who are taught they are “the Chosen People of Yah” (God) and nobody else is, that is sure a pack of lies evidenced by much “bad fruit” at the TT. They’ve gained quite a terrible reputation worldwide. But there are some wonderful people there, but very indoctrinated. The Bruderhof people are much more in line with Jesus’ love for others and not condemning everyone. The TT view themselves as the only ones, and “the only work of Yah on earth at this time.” In fact they say, they’re “the only ones who have the Holy Spirit, since the times of the apostles” and “the only ones who are doing Yah’s will.” Really???
@Eric Bruderhof is no alternative for Twelve Tribes.
Bruderhof are vaxxers. Twelve Tribes isn’t.
Aside from the fact that our bodies according to Psalm 139 are uniquely and marvelously formed in our mother’s wombs including our immune system and hence don’t need “improvedment” or “intervention”, we should always be careful to not let “them” inject stuff under our skin like the mark of the beast in revelation 13:16
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ifXg6X2sW9I
Twelve Tribes believes black people should still be slaves to white people, unless they become equal and forgiven by joining the twelve tribes cult. The bruderhof doesn’t believe that. Twelve Tribes believes you have to join their group in order to go to the best Heaven, the bruderhof doesn’t believe that. Both communes have problems. I don’t look to communal groups anymore to try to find friendship, or security, or a way to live according to conflicting Bible standards.
God’s children are everywhere, and so are those who have no desire to be. Including in every communal group.
I am visiting Oneonta NY for the summer, where the Tribe runs the Yellow Deli.
I was told about they’re Fri night meeting. I showed up, and talked to a few of them. They would only talk about ME. I couldn’t get much info out of them, other than one fellow, who was from my home in NV.
I told them I didn’t like ritual, and they said they didn’t either. So the “meeting” started, and it was quickly turned into a very repetitive song and circular dancing. It seemed about as ritualistic as possible. I stood back, and had told them my time was limited, as I had biked over, and don’t ride at night. “Stay for our food”, they begged. I take this as entrapment: a slippery slope. I left after 10 minutes of their strange song/music.
Their philosophy is quite simple, and discussion does not go very far. I’ve read on this site that blacks are not allowed to join. There was a black lady in attendance, but I don’t think anyone would join this group unless they were down and out. I think that is the main source of recruits.
If someone is seeking a more spiritual experience in a like minded group of people, I would suggest the Ratna Ling retreat centerin CA.
They feed you, house you, and in return you help out in their printshop making holy Tibetan texts. I believe they even pay a small stipend, after a few months.
I enjoyed my time there, although it was shortened by my own choice and life commitments.
Stopped in to see some members later on, and was welcomed back anytime I chose.
Chanting, meditation etc are practiced and encouraged, but you have complete autonomy to choose what you like to do. (The printshop is directed, but no sweatshop)
The area is beautiful, and is great for hiking.
The food is so good (vegetarian) you will gain weight.
A little bit of kitchen duty is required, on a rotating and fair schedule.
And no one dictates who gets married, or gives up their material possessions, or plays mindgames on you!
@DANNYBOY : and who needs to live up to the standards of the bible? some of the best people I know with the best kids I know follow the example of Jesus and practise what he preached. Now surprisingly those people also happen to not know much of what the bible actually says. And funny enough I have observed that people who know the bible really well, live by a million rules and are judgemental, even intolerant.
Find yourself fellow christians or just people in your town you can get involved like, I don’t know doing voluntary or charitable work or your local community garden. Of course take care of your family and relatives, love people, animals, nature. Do some meditation, eat clean food, love and know yourself first thing. You might be suffering from withdrawal symptoms from being part of a larger than life puffed up religion who shields you from the pain and stress of the world and seems to have all the answers to the complexities and difficulties of living in this very materialistic society. It is a struggle to be spiritual, whether you are a christian, a buddhist or simply have faith in god almighty, it is a struggle. The community seemed to have all the answers but it took away your personal power. It is a good thing to strive for godliness, don’t give up, many around you are struggling too and doing the best they can. Surround yourself by whatever and whoever resonates with you that you know to be true and good. All the best
@Ricoo Chie
See, this is what I mean.
Critics of the TT name the TT a thousand times, but when asked for an alternative group they begin to ramble communist ideas or, as you did, arbitrary stuff instead of naming alternative separatist groups ( e.g. “pay Jehovas Witnesses a visit” or “check out Islamic enclave so and so”).
We live in a society where it is extremely hard to raise children. You don’t have submissive wifes, they try to intoxicate your children’s body (vaccines, bad food, no obedience enforceable, plastics, toxins in food, smart phone adiction) AND mind (television, propagation of abominable stuff as being a wage slave for women, role models as insane as drag queens (that do it in the *where the sun won’t shine*) visiting kindergardens and schools in Europe.
Where is the exit to this insanity? You cannot out-meditate fallen and pervert society. OK, you can do it when living on your own, but how to raise children in such a society. You end up running the gauntlet as a family father!
” some of the best people…follow the example of Jesus and practise what he preached…not know much of what the bible actually says”
Ok. Jesus preached to meticulously follow torah rules up to the last tittle (at least until this abominable. So I wonder right now how they do that “not knowing the bible well”.
I don’t mind a zero tolerance policy on sin in a society, but I have a problem with being 24/7 on guard/surveillance and obsessively doing EVERY thing together up to sleeping in the same room and having abnormal working hours (why would a cafe be open 24 hours a day anyways? Not even Mc Donald’s has these crazy opening hours. I mean, who in his right mind decides in a small town at 3 am “ah, lets go to a cafe and pay the yellow deli a visit”???
Also, I noticed that being a single brother in the TT is rather undesireable. I know that many long-term members entered together as husband and wife and only 2nd generation members find their wife from inside the group (if the group even allows them).
I asked some conservative christian ladies that took a liking in myself to perhaps join TT . No success so far…
I really have grown a liking to islam.
It has conservative role models, modesty, it abhors communist ideals, sexual immorality and is positive towards private property and defensive measures. That is a massive plus.
However what is missing in islam is a “proof of concept” – a separatist society that follows islam and actually works and shines. I also don’t like the anti-christ teachings in islam and the prospect of not really returning to our creator but instead dwelling in some sort of whorehouse paradise with alcohol and free chicks. Sounds pretty worldly, huh?
Sorry, I misspelled. It should read: “Jesus preached to meticulously follow torah rules up to the last tittle (at least until this abominable age ends)”
” from being part of a larger than life puffed up religion who shields you from the pain and stress of the world ”
THIS is exactly what I am searching for! A separatist society that disconnected from the perverse age. However the TT interact a lot with the world, touring concerts and running cafes. They take in a lot of “lost folks” with communist ideas, not with ideas to follow the torah and thus have many deceivers and leavers that weaken the group at large. They are dragging in the wrong folks often times.
I also got the notion that a member will have to interact more with the world (because of the need of fulfilling biblical commands and the need of prospects) than some non-biblical separatists in the “outback”.
You said: “They take in a lot of “lost folks” with communist ideas, not with ideas to follow the torah and thus have many deceivers and leavers that weaken the group at large. They are dragging in the wrong folks often times.”
This is spot-on target. I was a new Christian, ex-Anarchist/Marxist psychedelic punk type of person and I responded to the TT message. I moved into their Dorchester townhouse and lived in the Community for about 9 months. I was a “leaver”.
However, I got saved in Christ BEFORE falling in with the TT, and I’m still Christian now (Reformed in theology) This is a fascinating thread to stumble upon.
Where to run in these end-of-times in the eyes of YOU TT critics? Any CONCRETE suggestions? Coordinates, please, guys! No atheist commie ramblings, please.
There are many “Intentional Communities” formed, who are living together without coercion or strategic abuse. If you specifically want to follow Jesus while living together, try the Bruderhof. Or even email the Bruderhof and ask them to help you find a group near you, since the Bruderhof has lots of friends who are doing the same thing outside of their own group. Otherwise, Google keyword “Intentional Communities” and you’ll find people coming together for many different reasons that are non-cult related.
What I think you are not seeing is that the TT is an extremely destructive group. Everyone who joins has their lives devistated. If you stay, the high stress/trauma is all you can handle so you give all you’ve got just to keep yourself from drowning. Once you leave, the PTSD sets in and you fall to pieces.
We can tell you’ve already begun to be indoctrinated, by the way. You are already using their talking points. We’ve been there, friend. We’ve already gone through it. We’re not trying to deprive you of anything. We’re trying to spare you and your loved ones the pain.
Thank you so much, Steven, for the reply,
crazily enough I just recently found out about Bruderhof and “anti-videos” and you are right. They are VERY similar (except child training, openness, and so on, but MANY details are similar). They are also doing similar businesses and try to approach autarky, however seemingly they do not stride to bring forth the 144k.
The more crazy thing is that I already believed that way before even knowing of the existence of the TT. I am even a little afraid of them, because points of view are that similar to mine (I got most of my views from end-times christian preachers and secular Alex Jones Infowars and esoteric related channels (e.g. Zeitgeist movie) starting at 9/11).
Do you know of such “intentional communities” that believe in private posessions to a certain degree (like Israeli Moshavs, or Islamic farming enclaves?). AFAIK only christian groups have this “all things common” radical thing. Just for information I mean.
Just for the record:
Bruderhof used child discipline/ corporal punishment until 1975 when they gave in to modern progressive educational principles.
Source: Janzen, “The Hutterites and the Bruderhof”, page 25
https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/1303/4c47387ba51fa483c5b6f8c61c9ad1047e8f.pdf
Yes, I know Steve, and I appreciate the warning. It is just so cruel that the group is soooo interesting and in tune with my value set and on the same time I can imagine the stress levels and possible failure due to one not being able to take it any more.
Therefor I seek alternatives just for theoretical comparison for the moment.
Mettal Leute!
I am reading Bernd Längin’s book “Gottes letzte Inseln”. The last chapter of this book about Mennonites and Amish is about “Hutterite Bruderhofs”. This is quite confusing to me.
1)
There is this community called Bruderhof having a huge media outlet originating in Hessen, Germany around WW1 which then fled the seizure of their children (remarkably similar to TT’s child raid in Germany) by the Nazi Reich around WW2 to England via Liechtenstein, then moved along to the US and Paraguay.
These folks portray themselves as surprisingly worldly and liberal. Including the promise to help ex-members to reestablish in the world if needed.
2)
In Längin’s book Hutterite Bruderhofs are portrayed vastly different with corporal punishment, shunnig of the world, ppl who leave finding themselves without support.
Is every Hutterite facility considered to be a Bruderhof? Or is the Bruderhofian Bruderhof very different from a Hutterite mansion, hence a totally different group?
Anyone?
Oh boy, this goes far deeper.
It is all written in a book “The Hutterites in North America” by Rod Janzen and Max Stanton.
In the book it is clearly described that German Arnold and his followers “overtook” the Bruderhof brand and Hutterite way of life after WW1, but modified it to be far too liberal (engagement in worldly stuff like politics, worldly philosophy, higher education outside of biblical knowledge etc.). The Arnold group, educated and wise in marketing named themselves “The Bruderhof” eversince and this very Bruderhof group joined Hutterite liberals after years of losely affiliation with liberal “Schmiedeleut” in the 70s and got thrown out by the 90s.
We are in for a steep learning curve in the end-of-times.
Love! Daniel
You say.. Where can one run to.. My question is why run? Go on your own, seek the truth, find your own answers and go from there. If your faith is that strong, why not trust God to guide you instead of a horny child basher. Figuratively speaking
I wrote GOD’S PEOPLE in Search of a Destiny based on my intimate relationship with many members and having lived in and visited many communities. The book is available as an e-download or a paperback, amazon.com/author/srlavin
Like any new age Christian group with their own brand of communal communism, selective Biblical focus, and high-end businesses and properties one readily sees these are a formidable group with a very clear agenda.
My book is an objective study of the good, the bad, and the intolerant structure that ultimately drives people away, often disappointed, or impoverished, and disillusioned.
The Twelve Tribes is in the news every so often answering charges of child abuse, antisemitism, homophobia, and racism.
But generally they are within the law and not found guilty of crimes. They have restaurants in many vibrant college towns, and their homes are often breath-taking estates.
Prerequisite to a visit, read ANIMAL FARM.
Thanks for Your great book and balanced opinion.
Four legs good, two legs baaaaadd!
Do you have any advice for a European community seeker? Perhaps in Israel?
Curious if there are any TT members running any WWOOFing programs in Oregon?
the closest TT community is in Raymond WA. I visited for a night 3 years ago
I also love their way of life and the people of the TT. But there are some problems. I believe people should form their own communities with new and better guidelines. A set work schedule for example is needed. Shifts. And do we really need to keep a deli open 24 hours a day? Do our brothers and sisters really need to be up at 3am, working the deli? I say NO.